bonus

Meklit Hadero on the Intersection of Music, Storytelling, and Community Building

Published on: 31st October, 2024

In this bonus episode, we dive into the intersection of music, storytelling, and community building with the incredible Meklit Hadero. Meklit shares insights from her journey as an Ethiopian American musician, storyteller, and cultural activist. We explore the powerful connection between music and migration and how Ethio-Jazz has shaped her artistry. Tune in to learn about the art of creating solidarity through music, Meklit's unique podcasting approach, and her latest projects.

Stream Movement with Meklit Hadero: https://qpnt.net/QY-W

Stream Meklit Hadero's Ethio Blue: https://qpnt.net/QY-X

Topics: #MeklitHadero #EthioJazz #BlackPodcasters #BlackMusic #MusicPodcast

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Transcript
Jay Ray:

Meklit Hadero is an Ethiopian-American vocalist,

Jay Ray:

songwriter, and composer, known

Jay Ray:

for her electric stage presence, innovative sound

Jay Ray:

and vibrant cultural activism.

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Her

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latest EP, titled Ethio Blue, was released March 8, 2024 and spent nearly 2 months

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at #12 on the NACC World Charts.

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Meklit’s Ethio-Jazz performances have taken her to renowned stages across 4

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continents.

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Her albums have topped world music charts across the US + Europe,

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received rave reviews, and been covered extensively by the press.

Jay Ray:

Meklit has

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collaborated with renowned artists such as Kronos Quartet, Andrew Bird,

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Preservation Hall Jazz Band, and the late creator of funk music, Pee Wee Ellis.

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Meklit has always straddled her creative practice with her passion for cultural

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activism.

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She is the former Chief of Program at Yerba Buena Center for the

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Arts in San Francisco, where she helped design and implement a

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slate of radical programs supporting social justice

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focused artists during the height

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of the pandemic.

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She is a sought after thought leader and speaker and has given

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talks on multiple TED Stages, at the UN, and at the National

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Geographic Storytellers

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Summit, as well as at institutions, organizations and

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Universities around the globe.

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Meklit is a National Geographic Explorer, a TED Senior Fellow, and a former

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Artistin-Residence at Harvard University.

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She is the co-founder of the Nile Project, a

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featured voice in UN Women’s theme song and the winner of the 2021 globalFEST

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Artist Award.

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Meklit has been a guest DJ on KCRW’s Morning Becomes Eclectic,

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created new works via commissions from Lincoln Center, MAP Fund, Center for the

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Art of Performance at UCLA, Stanford Live, NYU Abu Dhabi and many more.

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Her

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music has been featured by the New York Times, BBC, CNN, NPR, Washington Post,

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Vibe Magazine, San Francisco Chronicle, Boston Globe and many more.

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Meklit is co-founder, co-producer and host of Movement, a podcast, radio series

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, live performance series and community building initiative uplifting

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the stories, songs and cultural power of immigrant musicians.

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The show airs monthly on PRX’s

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The World to an audience of 2.5 million listeners.

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Season 2 of Movement launches

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July 16, 2024, wherever you get your podcasts.

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Enjoy the show.

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: Greetings and welcome to another episode of Queue Points podcast.

Jay Ray:

I am DJ Sir Daniel.

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And my name is Jay Ray, sometimes known by my government

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as Johnny Ray Kornegay III.

Jay Ray:

What's happening y'all.

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: Listen, Queue Points podcast is the podcast dropping

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the needle on black music history.

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And Jay Ray, I am so proud that we are a podcast, a movement that, um, is a

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staunch supporter of all black stories.

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Coming from not only here in the United States, but of course, all the stories

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that are coming from the diaspora.

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And we have a special guest on this episode, Jay Ray,

Jay Ray:

please introduce our guests.

Jay Ray:

Folks, um, we are incredibly excited to welcome

Jay Ray:

Meklit Hedero to Queue Points.

Jay Ray:

Meklit, welcome to the show.

Jay Ray:

How are you?

Meklit Hadero:

Oh, I'm so good.

Meklit Hadero:

It's so good to be here with you.

Meklit Hadero:

I love talking about all things diaspora.

Meklit Hadero:

So here I am at home, you know?

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: We had to do it.

Jay Ray:

Absolutely.

Jay Ray:

So we have several things we want to discuss with you.

Jay Ray:

Of course, we want to get into your podcast, but here's what's interesting.

Jay Ray:

Your podcast is a radio show.

Jay Ray:

So it's like podcast radio show all the movement.

Jay Ray:

And all the things, right?

Jay Ray:

But before we get into that, so I recently caught, um, that you did a performance.

Jay Ray:

This was back in August.

Jay Ray:

It was at the Yerba Buena Gardens Festival.

Meklit Hadero:

Yes.

Jay Ray:

I wanted to be here so bad.

Jay Ray:

So you did this performance.

Jay Ray:

It was, um, called Meklitz Movement Immigrant Orchestra.

Jay Ray:

And from the description, it was 13 musicians.

Jay Ray:

representing 11 countries, including India, Mexico, Ethiopia,

Jay Ray:

Cuba, Italy, Taiwan, Spain, Iran, Mali, Haiti, Palestine, Meklit.

Jay Ray:

Let's talk about you and your musicianship and a bit about what inspired you

Jay Ray:

to convene all of these musicians.

Meklit Hadero:

Well, thank you for asking about that moment, because I

Meklit Hadero:

have to say that was like one of the highlights of my entire musical career,

Meklit Hadero:

and I think, you know, the underlying.

Meklit Hadero:

thing for me is that I like to tell bigger stories together with other

Meklit Hadero:

artists than I can do by myself.

Meklit Hadero:

And I think when you get people together, um, there's from across, you know,

Meklit Hadero:

boundaries, whether those boundaries are invisible lines on a map that

Meklit Hadero:

are called countries, or whether they are, um, you know, uh, from different

Meklit Hadero:

communities and cultures of all kinds.

Meklit Hadero:

I think there's always a power in gathering folks and

Meklit Hadero:

there's an X factor in it.

Meklit Hadero:

So that actually, the movement immigrant orchestra actually started

Meklit Hadero:

out of this series of gatherings of immigrant musicians that we were having.

Meklit Hadero:

I was like, you know, our communities are under attack in a way that

Meklit Hadero:

is just constant and oppressive.

Meklit Hadero:

And we need to be together and understand from a place that

Meklit Hadero:

starts from our cultural power.

Meklit Hadero:

So we just started.

Meklit Hadero:

having gatherings and food and what happens when you get musicians

Meklit Hadero:

together is that they want to play.

Meklit Hadero:

And so we would, but people also had this very deep understanding of the struggles,

Meklit Hadero:

you know, like a lot of times immigrant communities can be siloed across ethnicity

Meklit Hadero:

or language or But we actually have a lot of the same struggles, we all, that's what

Meklit Hadero:

solidarity means, like actually we are all the same forces that are oppressing, you

Meklit Hadero:

know, it's, it's a cross, it's a cross.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, so we just, like, we started gathering folks and realized we had so many

Meklit Hadero:

stories that were echoes of each other.

Meklit Hadero:

And then we would be sharing these very deep, powerful stories with each other.

Meklit Hadero:

And then people would be like, you know, you get into an emotional space.

Meklit Hadero:

And But then you're like, okay, we're going to put it in the music and we

Meklit Hadero:

would have these jams that would just last and they were, you know, I was

Meklit Hadero:

like, yo, this, you know, the first one, there's this, um, uh, Malian and

Meklit Hadero:

Goni player called Mamadou Sidibe and he grows the gourds in Chico, California.

Meklit Hadero:

And then in Oakland, he builds them and they are these artworks.

Meklit Hadero:

They are these, I mean, they're literally like sound artworks.

Meklit Hadero:

Like they're so beautiful.

Meklit Hadero:

And he started playing with, um, a cellist from Korea and a guitarist

Meklit Hadero:

from Spain, and everybody was like.

Meklit Hadero:

Uh, I, it, uh, but like we, we literally, like, actually,

Meklit Hadero:

it's not a place for words.

Meklit Hadero:

It's a place for sounds and we just wanted to be together and

Meklit Hadero:

play together, and that's how the immigrant orchestra started.

Meklit Hadero:

But what I, but then what I didn't totally realize was how cathartic it would be

Meklit Hadero:

for the audience, you know, because we came from this, like, we built a

Meklit Hadero:

love amongst each other and, you know.

Meklit Hadero:

And then we were able to bring that to the audience and they wouldn't

Meklit Hadero:

let us go for two hours, two hours telling us the experiences that

Meklit Hadero:

they had had in this concert.

Meklit Hadero:

So it was very special.

Meklit Hadero:

We will be doing more of it.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, we need solidarity.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, and when we can do it with cultural power at the center, then we

Meklit Hadero:

can invite so many others into that space of, of love and connection.

Jay Ray:

Yeah.

Jay Ray:

Mm-Hmm?

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: know, McLee, as I listen to you speak, um, what stands out to

Jay Ray:

me is something that I've always, that I always talk about on this show when

Jay Ray:

we discuss the power of music and the fact that musicians, singers, musicians,

Jay Ray:

when you're in that moment, there is.

Jay Ray:

Being in that moment of being on stage and playing together as a

Jay Ray:

collective is a cracking open, cracking open of your spirit to allow the

Jay Ray:

source to come and move through you.

Jay Ray:

That's what happens during our praise and worship at church.

Jay Ray:

You know, when, when music is involved and those emotions get high, there's

Jay Ray:

a cracking open of your spirit and it allows the source to come through.

Jay Ray:

And I say that all the time.

Jay Ray:

And that's what I'm hearing about.

Jay Ray:

That experience that J Ray was speaking of, but you also get

Jay Ray:

to experience something that I feel is also life changing.

Jay Ray:

And that's travel, travel changes.

Jay Ray:

You travel makes you a different person.

Jay Ray:

And as an, as an immigrant myself, I experienced that as a, as a child.

Jay Ray:

So what, what are you hoping or what is your plan to bring that

Jay Ray:

experience to a larger audience?

Jay Ray:

Um, To create, to let, to allow everybody else to feel that shift,

Jay Ray:

because like you said, right now, immigrants are under attack.

Jay Ray:

Black people are, Black people are under attack and they don't understand.

Jay Ray:

And a lot of times we don't understand that we're all one in the same.

Jay Ray:

And just because we may have been born someplace different,

Jay Ray:

there are, there are powers that be that are trying to eliminate.

Jay Ray:

Um, large groups of people.

Jay Ray:

So in your messaging and in your travels and all the work that you're

Jay Ray:

doing, you're doing, what is your game plan to, to use your, your powers

Jay Ray:

to crack that collective experience?

Meklit Hadero:

Oh, you just got right to the heart of 2024, didn't you?

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: That's

Jay Ray:

It's what we do here on Q.

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: That's what I do.

Jay Ray:

That's what we do.

Meklit Hadero:

you know, I, first of all, there's so many, like,

Meklit Hadero:

when it comes to cultural strategy, there's never, like, you can't

Meklit Hadero:

actually come at it in just one way.

Meklit Hadero:

So what I, what I want to say is that there's a few different ways

Meklit Hadero:

that I can answer that question and I'll just run through them.

Meklit Hadero:

And then you stop me if you have questions in between, cause you know, I could talk.

Meklit Hadero:

Talk

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Love that.

Meklit Hadero:

I could just keep going.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, okay.

Meklit Hadero:

From a personal place.

Meklit Hadero:

I just want to speak for a moment about my music.

Meklit Hadero:

I make music that's Ethiopian jazz.

Meklit Hadero:

I stand on the shoulders of Giants.

Meklit Hadero:

I am on a continuum.

Meklit Hadero:

The music that I make is deeply influenced by Ethiopian pentatonic

Meklit Hadero:

scales, melodies, and rhythms.

Meklit Hadero:

African music and jazz is also African music.

Jay Ray:

Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

And so it There, for me, making Ethio Jazz is a place where

Meklit Hadero:

I have turned my experience of African diaspora solidarity into a sound practice

Meklit Hadero:

that I speak about everywhere I go.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, There's an amazing story about the origin of Ethiopian jazz, which

Meklit Hadero:

is that there's a man by the name of, um, is the creator of Ethiopian jazz.

Meklit Hadero:

And if you know, like the Ethiopiques, like the, like all those first

Meklit Hadero:

Ethiopiques that folks would hear.

Meklit Hadero:

That was him as the composer and vibraphonist and conga player.

Meklit Hadero:

Now, itio jazz came about because Murata Astatke was the first African to graduate

Meklit Hadero:

from the Berkeley college of music.

Meklit Hadero:

And he went to New York and he was playing congas with a bunch of Cuban congeros

Meklit Hadero:

and he saw, Hey, they're bringing their.

Meklit Hadero:

Traditional music into a relationship with jazz.

Meklit Hadero:

And then there's a famous story of him, uh, playing with John Coltrane

Meklit Hadero:

and Coltrane took him aside and said, yo, you gotta bring your

Meklit Hadero:

traditional music together with jazz.

Meklit Hadero:

Like you bring it to the root.

Meklit Hadero:

He ended up moving back to Ethiopia and created Ethio jazz from there.

Meklit Hadero:

So there would be no Ethiopian jazz without not only the mentorship

Meklit Hadero:

of African American giants.

Meklit Hadero:

Of music, but also Cuban musicians.

Meklit Hadero:

And we know that the, the histories of forced migration that birthed, that

Meklit Hadero:

birthed the music of the Americas runs deeply, deeply through every single

Meklit Hadero:

time that I stand on a stage and sing, I sing solidarity like that is my.

Meklit Hadero:

So there's, sometimes I like to say that we use music to talk about the

Meklit Hadero:

things that are hard to talk about the places where our tongues get stuck.

Meklit Hadero:

And so.

Meklit Hadero:

The, the first thing I'm going to do is I'm going to, the first thing I'm

Meklit Hadero:

going to do is I'm going to write songs that acknowledge history, that look

Meklit Hadero:

history in the eye, and do not erase any peoples from any, from any story.

Meklit Hadero:

So that's number one, number one, number one.

Meklit Hadero:

Number two, the, the project, you know, Movement is a podcast, it's a

Meklit Hadero:

radio show, it's a live performance experience that is about the

Meklit Hadero:

intersection of music and migration.

Meklit Hadero:

Here's the way I think about it.

Meklit Hadero:

We have a national strategy that is our podcast and radio show that's

Meklit Hadero:

about narratives of migration based in the people who have experienced it.

Meklit Hadero:

That means our stories coming from lived experiences with nuance.

Meklit Hadero:

With tenderness with a focus on ancestral wisdom, continuum, epiphany, um, right as

Meklit Hadero:

we can look pain, trauma, and difficulty in the eye and say that we get to make the

Meklit Hadero:

meaning out of all of those experiences.

Meklit Hadero:

Now, at the same time, understanding that we're in a place where oppression

Meklit Hadero:

must be challenged every single day, but oppression cannot be challenged

Meklit Hadero:

only on You know, only in this way, like what I started to understand

Meklit Hadero:

was that, like, I loved making the podcast and the radio show, but I

Meklit Hadero:

needed it to live in my community too.

Meklit Hadero:

I needed it to be in my everyday where I walked down the street and to be able

Meklit Hadero:

to have an impact on my direct community and the movement and the movement

Meklit Hadero:

gathering strategy, the immigrant orchestra, our solidarity building

Meklit Hadero:

strategy really comes out of that.

Meklit Hadero:

So, and it's also, uh, solidarity also for me means that.

Meklit Hadero:

We understand that in the age of climate crisis like things are

Meklit Hadero:

probably about to get a lot more difficult before they get better.

Meklit Hadero:

And we need each other we need interconnection to be able to be,

Meklit Hadero:

to be able to not just withstand but to create new systems that

Meklit Hadero:

are based from the ground up.

Meklit Hadero:

And so,

Meklit Hadero:

So, so the Immigrant Orchestra, our gathering strategy, building solidarity,

Meklit Hadero:

not just within immigrant communities, but across oppressed communities, is a

Meklit Hadero:

part of how we create new systems that will actually get us to the place we

Meklit Hadero:

want to go, which is non hierarchical, which is based in culture and cultural

Meklit Hadero:

power, which is, um, organized, which is being able to say what our communities

Meklit Hadero:

need and pressure the people who are in power to support us in getting where we

Meklit Hadero:

folks what they need every single day.

Meklit Hadero:

I think I'll stop.

Jay Ray:

Wow.

Jay Ray:

I have a question in here.

Jay Ray:

It is.

Jay Ray:

I find it so innovative that you as a multifaceted creative also decided

Jay Ray:

to insert podcasting into your work.

Jay Ray:

Wind.

Jay Ray:

Wind.

Jay Ray:

How did that come about?

Jay Ray:

Because I, seeing this is like, Oh my goodness.

Jay Ray:

This is like the perfect way to extend these conversations, these stories, right?

Jay Ray:

That, that impact people so deeply.

Jay Ray:

So how did that epiphany come?

Meklit Hadero:

It wasn't an epiphany.

Meklit Hadero:

I wish it was.

Meklit Hadero:

I wish I had a great epiphany story for you, but you know how sometimes things

Meklit Hadero:

are just one foot in front of the other,

Jay Ray:

Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

you know, sometimes it's like, well, you know, anyway, um, I had

Meklit Hadero:

a very dear friend called Julie Kane.

Meklit Hadero:

She is now, um, Senior editor at through line, which is, um, a new show

Meklit Hadero:

on NPR and they do, um, long form.

Meklit Hadero:

They do hour long documentaries weekly, which are amazing.

Meklit Hadero:

And Julie was, um, Julie invited me.

Meklit Hadero:

She basically was like, Hey, I want to make a podcast about world music.

Meklit Hadero:

What do you think?

Meklit Hadero:

And we started to, at the time I was, I had a booking, I had a

Meklit Hadero:

booking agency with my partner.

Meklit Hadero:

It was like a very little boutique booking agency and it was called 2042.

Meklit Hadero:

And it was about, at that time, back in 2017, that was the year that the United

Meklit Hadero:

States was no longer projected to have a cultural majority or an ethnic majority.

Meklit Hadero:

I don't like the word majority minority because we're not a

Meklit Hadero:

minority, actually, in the world.

Meklit Hadero:

We're the, we're the majority.

Jay Ray:

are Right.

Meklit Hadero:

you know,

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: call a thing, a thing

Jay Ray:

right?

Meklit Hadero:

you know, so, so we had, so, and I was telling her about 2042, and

Meklit Hadero:

then we decided together Like let's, let's do a podcast about music and migration.

Meklit Hadero:

And so we kind of started, uh, we started cooking it and she brought in an amazing

Meklit Hadero:

producer who has been my ride or die, Ian Coss, who's like, just want a Peabody.

Meklit Hadero:

He's genius.

Meklit Hadero:

He's like the most trust based heartfelt person.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, yeah.

Meklit Hadero:

multi talented musician, editor, sound designer, and we started making stuff, and

Meklit Hadero:

then, uh, and then it evolved into this today, and it took a long time, took a

Meklit Hadero:

long time to find our partners, we knocked on many doors, many people were like, yes,

Meklit Hadero:

yes, yes, yes, no, yes, yes, yes, yes, uh uh, yes, yes, yes, yes, no, no, no,

Meklit Hadero:

no, no, no, no, no, no, and so we just, we had to find our own way, you know,

Jay Ray:

Yeah.

Jay Ray:

Wow, wow, wow, wow.

Jay Ray:

Um, really quickly.

Jay Ray:

So in listening to movement, um.

Jay Ray:

You hear the sound design, you hear your storytelling in there as, um,

Jay Ray:

I love the way you just process the conversations that you're having with

Jay Ray:

the folks that you're talking to.

Jay Ray:

Um, you're welcome.

Jay Ray:

Um, so my question to you is how, if at all, is the making of these movement

Jay Ray:

episodes kind of like songwriting?

Jay Ray:

Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

It's, it's very creative.

Meklit Hadero:

It's a very creative process.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, it's very different from songwriting is I think of songwriting as a mix

Meklit Hadero:

of discipline and mystery, you know, um, you know, if you, if you ask

Meklit Hadero:

a lot of songwriters and you say, well, where did the song come from?

Meklit Hadero:

They're like, I don't, I don't, I don't really know.

Meklit Hadero:

You know, and it's, it's kind of like you and the, and it's about that

Meklit Hadero:

cracking open that you talked about

Meklit Hadero:

before.

Meklit Hadero:

So, so songwriting for me is like catching melodies as they come,

Meklit Hadero:

recording them, and then going into the studio and like, Working it,

Meklit Hadero:

working it, working it, working it.

Meklit Hadero:

So the essay writing, the storytelling, is a working it,

Meklit Hadero:

working, and it's very emotional.

Meklit Hadero:

It's actually, it's actually kind of difficult, you know, because you have to

Meklit Hadero:

process, I don't know, like, not in a lot.

Meklit Hadero:

It's just like you have to find a little fractal place in your own life

Meklit Hadero:

where some huge question gets distilled into like a very simple exchange.

Meklit Hadero:

And so it's actually interesting.

Meklit Hadero:

I haven't thought about it, but I have started collecting stories,

Meklit Hadero:

the way I collect melodies and then finding where I can insert them.

Meklit Hadero:

So maybe it's more, maybe this question has brought out for me how

Meklit Hadero:

it's more similar than I realized.

Meklit Hadero:

And then I do have to like work it, work, work, work.

Meklit Hadero:

And it's different because it's prose.

Meklit Hadero:

And then I have to speak it out loud.

Meklit Hadero:

So I write it, I speak it, I edit it.

Meklit Hadero:

Cause it has to sound good spoken.

Meklit Hadero:

So that's very different, but it's sort of similar when you write something and then

Meklit Hadero:

you sing it and you realize, Oh, okay.

Meklit Hadero:

The phrasing, all the phrasing of this word, I need a word.

Meklit Hadero:

That's kind of two, that's two syllables here.

Meklit Hadero:

I can't use the word that's for, you know, so, so it is a Cree.

Meklit Hadero:

It is a very creative process.

Meklit Hadero:

What I'll say that's different.

Meklit Hadero:

That's really fun for me is that I've not.

Meklit Hadero:

I haven't ever quite done the essay based creative writing that I have to

Meklit Hadero:

do to make the stories come alive in the podcast and that's a new muscle

Meklit Hadero:

for me and I'm really enjoying it.

Meklit Hadero:

I do love it.

Meklit Hadero:

Like I find that the final Outcome is like this exact place between like, just

Meklit Hadero:

speaking a story and then like crafting, you know, the crafting part of it.

Meklit Hadero:

So I, I actually really enjoy it, even though it's, it's a challenge.

Meklit Hadero:

It's not like, it takes me time.

Meklit Hadero:

I don't, it's not instantaneous at all.

Meklit Hadero:

I'll work on an essay for like two weeks.

Meklit Hadero:

Stuff like, you know, things like that.

Jay Ray:

Mm.

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: And so I, you know, and, and listening to, um, movement and what

Jay Ray:

resonates with me a lot is the fact that as an immigrant, like I said before, I

Jay Ray:

came to this country at two years old, uh, from Barbados and growing up and being.

Jay Ray:

And matriculating through American culture and being a part of American culture.

Jay Ray:

And I don't know if you experienced it, experienced this, but there

Jay Ray:

is becoming more and more.

Jay Ray:

There's a voice that's getting louder amongst.

Jay Ray:

Black Americans, um, that are, feel like they're in, uh, not competition,

Jay Ray:

but there is this, I don't know, this weirdness that has, that I'm feeling

Jay Ray:

developed, not even developing, but it's been there for a while.

Jay Ray:

And you hear things because we're so, we're so, you know, we're so stealth

Jay Ray:

because I'm, I'm here, I've been here.

Jay Ray:

So I'm S but I'm stuff.

Jay Ray:

And I hear the things I hear the comments every now and then I hear the little.

Jay Ray:

You know, those foreigners, this, those immigrants, that, you

Jay Ray:

know, uh, Caribbean people think they're better than everybody.

Jay Ray:

Africans do this and that, you know, you hear little stuff like that.

Jay Ray:

And I'm wondering how you've dealt with it.

Jay Ray:

Does a movement help you help in that healing process?

Jay Ray:

Because I think for me, I try not to get.

Jay Ray:

sidetracked by all those conversations, because I really do

Jay Ray:

believe that that's just another distraction to keep us fragmented.

Jay Ray:

And of course, when we're fragmented, you know, the powers

Jay Ray:

that be are going to keep winning.

Jay Ray:

And so, but I'm just wondering for you, McCleat, like in, in doing movement.

Jay Ray:

And, and, and, and healing.

Jay Ray:

Does that bring about a healing for you as we deal with this amongst

Jay Ray:

ourselves in this community, as black people from all parts of the

Jay Ray:

diaspora, all parts of the world?

Meklit Hadero:

Yeah.

Meklit Hadero:

It's a very good question.

Meklit Hadero:

It's a very honest question.

Meklit Hadero:

I just want to thank you for your vulnerability also, because

Meklit Hadero:

that is, that's, it's painful.

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

It's painful.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, and you know, for me, like definitely growing up, I had a lot

Meklit Hadero:

of questions about where I belonged.

Meklit Hadero:

And, um,

Meklit Hadero:

I think that, you know, You know, I got called African booty

Meklit Hadero:

scratcher growing up in New York.

Meklit Hadero:

I also came to this

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Oh, what part of New

Meklit Hadero:

years old.

Meklit Hadero:

Oh, um, Crown Heights,

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Me too!

Meklit Hadero:

I grew up in Crown Heights.

Meklit Hadero:

Yes!

Meklit Hadero:

760 Crown Street between Utica and um, Eastern Parkway.

Meklit Hadero:

lived on Eastern Parkway.

Meklit Hadero:

We lived, um, but we lived all over Brooklyn.

Meklit Hadero:

We lived in Bay Ridge.

Meklit Hadero:

And then, um, at the end we lived, uh, in Park Slope.

Meklit Hadero:

We lived in all those places, the eighties.

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Mm hmm.

Meklit Hadero:

Mm

Meklit Hadero:

so, um, And definitely all of those things happened.

Meklit Hadero:

And I think that, you know, here's my generous.

Meklit Hadero:

So there are ways that I can look at these things with.

Meklit Hadero:

Like, I, I look at them from different levels.

Meklit Hadero:

I, so one level, and I don't mean to do this, it's kind of more like this.

Meklit Hadero:

It's not a hierarchy, it's like

Jay Ray:

Right?

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: hmm.

Meklit Hadero:

seeds, you know?

Meklit Hadero:

So one way that I look at it is that, you know, when we came to this country,

Meklit Hadero:

there was a moment where my parents had to understand what race was.

Meklit Hadero:

that is a very alienating thing.

Meklit Hadero:

If you're an African American person hearing an African say, what is race?

Meklit Hadero:

That sounds like a slap in the face.

Meklit Hadero:

I can, I can walk into and, and the reason that I can, so I can walk

Meklit Hadero:

into that conversation with empathy right from the start, but because

Meklit Hadero:

I have lived both sides, right?

Meklit Hadero:

Because I've, because my communities are both communities.

Meklit Hadero:

And what I mean by that is that in Ethiopia, it's all about ethnicity.

Meklit Hadero:

It's all about like, are you Amhara?

Meklit Hadero:

Are you like, I'm actually also, to ethnicity.

Meklit Hadero:

My father is from a place called Kambatha, which is in the south of Ethiopia.

Meklit Hadero:

It's not a ethnic group that has a lot of political power.

Meklit Hadero:

It's, it's like relatively small.

Meklit Hadero:

There's not a lot of language speakers.

Meklit Hadero:

Uh, my mother is Amhara, which is one of the, you know, larger tribes that has had

Meklit Hadero:

historically a lot of political power.

Meklit Hadero:

That itself was like an inter ethnic marriage.

Meklit Hadero:

That was a big deal back then, you know?

Meklit Hadero:

Um, so they come to this country and they, and they have these identities.

Meklit Hadero:

that have a meaning for them, given the context that they were

Meklit Hadero:

in, and then everyone around them tells them, that doesn't matter.

Meklit Hadero:

What matters is that you're black.

Meklit Hadero:

And it's like, well, what does it mean to be black?

Meklit Hadero:

And you have to learn.

Meklit Hadero:

And so, and you also have to, so, so, so, so, so I try to have empathy for both

Meklit Hadero:

sides because also for my parents, it's like a shock, they're like, wait, what?

Meklit Hadero:

You know?

Meklit Hadero:

So, so, so I think there's like a basic,

Meklit Hadero:

um, lack of communication or, or like just understanding of context that

Meklit Hadero:

kind of leads to some of this stuff.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, and then somebody saying, well, you don't think you're us.

Meklit Hadero:

There was a lot of that.

Meklit Hadero:

And I, you know, for me and I was like, well, what does somebody see walking down

Meklit Hadero:

the street for me, you know, and then so then you're living this in between and

Meklit Hadero:

that was like my whole teenage years, you know, like my whole teenage years

Meklit Hadero:

was trying to find peace with that.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, and I honestly did it through reading black American literature,

Meklit Hadero:

you know, and talking to and talking to my community, you know, and

Meklit Hadero:

that's how I that's how I like.

Meklit Hadero:

And then reading like Audre Lorde and, um, bell hooks and, but then literally

Meklit Hadero:

Toni Morrison and Ralph Ellison and that's how I, that's how I, that,

Meklit Hadero:

so because all of them are speaking these very complex stories and saying

Meklit Hadero:

nobody gets to make anyone a monolith.

Meklit Hadero:

And then I was saying, Oh, okay.

Meklit Hadero:

It's okay for me to not be a monolith.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, I can accept my complexity and my hybridity.

Meklit Hadero:

And I might be a paragraph.

Meklit Hadero:

I'm not a sentence.

Meklit Hadero:

But I'm pretty much guessing that they aren't either.

Meklit Hadero:

And somebody tries to make you just, to, you know, describe

Meklit Hadero:

you as two words, a black man.

Meklit Hadero:

Yes, you are and maybe sensitive and an introvert and you know like and

Meklit Hadero:

you're and your roots are from North Carolina and your roots might be from

Meklit Hadero:

Congo or you know, like it's just we all have We all have so much and

Meklit Hadero:

like, nobody can simplify any of us.

Meklit Hadero:

solidarity building as a strategy and a practice is always about

Meklit Hadero:

understanding that we have more in common than we do apart.

Meklit Hadero:

And, I think my healing So, oh, the one thing I wanted to say, there's

Meklit Hadero:

this, the first episode that we did in the podcast, season one, episode

Meklit Hadero:

one, is a brother called Oddisee, and I don't know if y'all know

Jay Ray:

Oh MC producer all the above.

Jay Ray:

Yes.

Jay Ray:

Yes.

Jay Ray:

Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

Sudanese and African American.

Meklit Hadero:

he tells this amazing story because he became the bridge between exactly what

Meklit Hadero:

you were talking about, where he would go to his African American family and

Meklit Hadero:

they would be talking about foreigners.

Meklit Hadero:

And he would go to his Sudanese family and they would be talking about African

Meklit Hadero:

American people and he would be like, No, he would say no, but what about

Meklit Hadero:

and he transformed his family as a hybrid, as a bridge, as a bridge.

Meklit Hadero:

And so.

Meklit Hadero:

Like, I do think that there's so much that happens when love is involved, you know,

Meklit Hadero:

when personal connection is involved.

Meklit Hadero:

And that can be like between friends, that can be within a family,

Meklit Hadero:

that can be within a community.

Meklit Hadero:

But we do have so much more in common than we do different.

Meklit Hadero:

And the oppressive forces that seek to destroy us, that seek to

Meklit Hadero:

minimize us and strip us of our power are the same exact ones.

Meklit Hadero:

So who is winning?

Meklit Hadero:

Who is winning when, when those things, when those words get spoken?

Meklit Hadero:

And so there is a deep healing that needs to happen.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, and you know, I think that, you know,

Meklit Hadero:

there's a, there's a strange thing that happens when we think

Meklit Hadero:

things are our own struggles.

Meklit Hadero:

We think we, we think they, it is up to me to solve this, this deep wound.

Meklit Hadero:

But this is a systemic problem.

Meklit Hadero:

This is a systemic problem that needs systemic solutions that are

Meklit Hadero:

working at very large scale levels.

Meklit Hadero:

I think we're further along than we ever have been, even as we still see

Meklit Hadero:

those narratives popping up in people that we love, you know, in people

Meklit Hadero:

that we love and, and cherish and adore, and we don't, you know, so,

Meklit Hadero:

so we can be nodes of healing, and our healing can radiate outwards, And

Meklit Hadero:

at the same time, like, these are, these are systemic questions that have

Meklit Hadero:

to be answered at a systems level.

Jay Ray:

Wow.

Jay Ray:

Meklit, thank you so much for sharing your gift, your gift of storytelling,

Jay Ray:

your gift of understanding and healing, um, with the Queue Points audience.

Jay Ray:

Um, so what are some things, um, that you would like to share with our folks

Jay Ray:

that people should be on the lookout for?

Jay Ray:

That you want to prep the folks for any upcoming performances, that sort of thing.

Meklit Hadero:

Well, uh, well, I do want to say that I released an album earlier

Meklit Hadero:

this year called Ethioblue and, um, it was my first album in several years.

Meklit Hadero:

You know, pandemic.

Meklit Hadero:

I have a five year old.

Meklit Hadero:

So

Jay Ray:

wants to be on the record, I'm sure.

Meklit Hadero:

need I say more?

Meklit Hadero:

No, he is on the record.

Jay Ray:

Oh.

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: Oh,

Meklit Hadero:

He is on the record.

Meklit Hadero:

He's on the record.

Meklit Hadero:

The very first song, Antidote, he was four months old when we, when we

Meklit Hadero:

recorded, we were doing some recording and he was making such cute sounds.

Meklit Hadero:

We were like, okay, come on, come on in front of a mic.

Meklit Hadero:

And he was like, it's like,

Meklit Hadero:

there's like a little bit of that the right way.

Meklit Hadero:

And then I am, uh, I just got the masters of a new record that will

Meklit Hadero:

come out next year on Smithsonian Folkways called A Piece of Infinity,

Meklit Hadero:

and it's, um, uh, interpretations of several different traditional

Meklit Hadero:

Ethiopian songs with some originals.

Meklit Hadero:

There's a very special song in there called Stars in a Wide Field that

Meklit Hadero:

is based on, um, the, Children's riddles from my father's tribe

Meklit Hadero:

Kambatha that are translated and they're like, it's a cosmology.

Meklit Hadero:

It's a universe.

Meklit Hadero:

It's a war.

Meklit Hadero:

It's like literally seeing into into the way of being the way people walk

Meklit Hadero:

through the world, you know, so that's like a collaboration between like

Meklit Hadero:

You know, millions of children and me, you know, because they're also

Meklit Hadero:

like, they're also, they're a mix of improvised and, uh, improvised riddles

Meklit Hadero:

and like, like, you know, like in traditional poetry, people memorize like

Meklit Hadero:

thousands and thousands of them, and then you got to bring them out at the

Meklit Hadero:

right time, like that kind of thing.

Jay Ray:

That's so exciting.

Meklit Hadero:

Thank

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: McCleat, I, and I, uh, I know I can speak for Jay Ray on this.

Meklit Hadero:

I am so happy that you took the time out to join us on this episode of Queue

Meklit Hadero:

Points and to share your perspective and take us on this journey with you.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, like I said, we see each other, you know, that

Meklit Hadero:

Yes, I do.

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: had that I had that opportunity to share that experience and I

Meklit Hadero:

hope that, um, other people, you know, can get a glance into that part of our lives.

Meklit Hadero:

And I'm, we're so excited for what's coming up from you, but please let our

Meklit Hadero:

audience know how they can find you also.

Meklit Hadero:

Yes.

Meklit Hadero:

Um, so you can find me on all the things, on all the socials at

Meklit Hadero:

Meklitmusic, M E K L I T music.

Meklit Hadero:

com.

Meklit Hadero:

That's my Instagram handle, TikTok, like all those things.

Meklit Hadero:

And then, listen, I live in San Francisco, and if you forget my

Meklit Hadero:

name You can literally Google Ethiopian singer, San Francisco.

Meklit Hadero:

And I come right up,

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Boom.

Meklit Hadero:

Boom.

Meklit Hadero:

There

Meklit Hadero:

I'm telling you, because like part of the thing is I'm

Meklit Hadero:

like, people forget how to find me.

Meklit Hadero:

They're like, what was her name that I liked her.

Meklit Hadero:

What was that Ethiopian singer, San Francisco.

Meklit Hadero:

Okay.

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: Dope.

Meklit Hadero:

Dope.

Meklit Hadero:

The one and only Maclete Hedero.

Meklit Hadero:

Thank you once again for joining us on this episode of Queue Points.

Meklit Hadero:

As I always say, Jay Ray, in this life, you have an opportunity.

Meklit Hadero:

You can either pick up a needle or you can let the record play.

Meklit Hadero:

I'm DJ Sir Daniel,

Jay Ray:

My name is Jay Ray and thank you so much, Meklit Hedero,

Jay Ray:

for joining us as well, y'all.

Jay Ray:

DJ Sir Daniel: and this has been,

Meklit Hadero:

well, everyone.

Meklit Hadero:

DJ Sir Daniel: thank you.

Meklit Hadero:

And this has been Queue Points podcast, dropping the

Meklit Hadero:

needle on black music history.

Meklit Hadero:

We'll see you on the next go round.

Meklit Hadero:

Peace.

Jay Ray:

Peace, y'all.

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About the Podcast

Queue Points
Queue Points is the Black Podcasting Award and Ambie Award nominated music podcast that is dropping the needle on Black Music history and celebrating Black music through meaningful dialogue. The show is hosted by DJ Sir Daniel and Jay Ray. Visit https://queuepoints.com to learn more.
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About your hosts

DJ Sir Daniel

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DJ Sir Daniel is a DJ/Selector and part of Atlanta's, all-vinyl crew, Wax Fundamentals. Co-host of the Queue Points podcast, he is an advocate for DJ culture and is passionate about creating atmospheres of inclusivity and jubilation from a Black perspective.

Jay Ray

Profile picture for Jay Ray
Johnnie Ray Kornegay III (Jay Ray) is a podcast consultant and co-host and producer of Queue Points, the Ambie Award-nominated podcast that drops the needle on Black music history. In addition to his duties at Queue Points, he is the Deputy Director of Strategy and Impact for CNP (Counter Narrative Project). A photographer, creative consultant and social commentator, Jay Ray's work is centered around a commitment to telling full and honest stories about communities often ignored.